I’ve met so many incredible people in the near 12 months that I’ve been writing this blog. Every one of them have had incredible stories to tell whether it’s sharing their own battles with mental health or working hard to raise money in aid of the many great organisations which support the cause.

Everyone’s story is different on an individual basis, but if there’s one thing they all have in common it’s that being honest with yourself and reaching out for help will only benefit you.

By reaching out, you’re making a huge step by allowing yourself to come out of the dark periods fighting. You’re showing that you won’t let the negativity win, you’re strong and pretty damn awesome.

The person I’ve spoken to for this week’s blog pretty much does exactly that. Luke Jones has used his experiences to help and inspire others with his Facebook page ‘Start The Conversation’. On the page he offers guidance for anyone who’s struggling whilst showing there’s no shame in admitting you need a bit of help.

He’s recently appeared on both BBC and ITV Wales News to speak about his views regarding the over eagerness to prescribe medication for mental health conditions without any real conversation or understanding to the person who’s struggling.

He’s a fantastic mental health advocate and yet another incredible person I’ve spoken to on this journey I’ve been on for this blog.
I’m so grateful that he agreed to sit down with me over a Zoom chat to talk about a number of factors including mental health, music, coping mechanisms and so many other important topics.

You’ve been doing a lot of campaigning for mental health via your ‘Start The Conversation’ page on Facebook. What inspired you to do this?

It all started when I had a really bad experience speaking to a doctor. I called them in order to seek some help with my mental health and it was a really shit time to be perfectly honest with you.

I didn’t expect them to be that lackadaisical and blasé with their approach but they were and that really surprised me. Obviously when you’re in a state of shock like that you do get on with it in some ways but I did speak to my family and my partner about it.

The common response I had from telling them about my experience was that it wasn’t the right as to how they approached my problem. I started looking at other support systems on the internet as a way of responding to this and by doing my own research I found that the way I was treated was occurring quite often.

It’s a shame that a common theme such as this is apparent but it was and there was a lot of people like me who felt sort of brushed off if anything by their GPs. I wanted something that would bridge that gap between starting a conversation around mental health and getting help as a result of it.

There’s so many mental services out there who do incredible work but there’s a lot of GPs who aren’t aware and directing people towards them. Like if you live in Cwm Taf, this is what’s available and the same for RCT or any other area.

That’s why I set it up in order to promote these fantastic services but also to talk about mental health a bit more, share my story and if anyone has gone through anything similar and/or feels they can speak about their own problems to me privately and I do a bit of signposting as well.

Those are some reasons I set up the page but also I knew that ‘Start The Conversation’ would be a good handle to have but also I wanted to delve into what starting these conversations meant for other people. It could have been anything like spotting certain traits and behaviour changes with a friend, family member or colleague and how to start a conversation with them.

On the flip side I also try to highlight that there’s a lot of difficulty in doing that at the moment due to those social interactions aren’t available at the moment due to the lockdown. It’s a lot harder to notice these things and help others due to the challenging times we’re in.

The main reason I started it was for people to feel empowered and to start talking about mental health more openly without any stigmas. If they feel unwell and low but confident enough to speak up and get help goes a long way and I really wanted to help with that. My own experiences gave me so much motivation but the research that I did really did give me a push in the right direction as well and here I am today.

I’ve only been doing it a month but the response has been incredible. I was always in two minds about it as I always had the “why” factor but not the “how”. How can I get this across without it turning it into something where people are talking over each other like a forum.

I wanted a more community feel I guess and I’ve always had a good feel from a Facebook page when I’ve used them for the bands I’ve been in over the years. It’s good to get your message across but also have people speak to you, it works wonders both ways so a page was a fantastic way to get this message across.

I’ll also use Instagram as I do get a few messages on there and the same with Twitter but I feel there’s more traffic on Facebook so that’s the main point of focus for the time being. I’m always learning as well which is an essential part of what I’m doing and I love it.

You’ve been very open about your concerns about the state of mental health care during the lockdown, especially with medication. What issues have you come across and faced yourself?

The main issue I found was the over eagerness and nonchalant approach to upping people’s medication without any real thought of what the medication does and how it helps a person with what they are going through.

Like I said on the page, you can’t complete mental health, it’s not like a computer game where you go through different levels and complete it.

There has to be short and long term goals with mental health which will help us along our journey to a healthier wellbeing. The majority of people that I’ve spoken to has said pretty much the same thing which is that they’ve felt low or depressed and have been prescribed medication over the phone without any real guidance or explanation.

Some of these people have never ever been given meds before yet they’re given them so easy and that’s a concern for sure. What needs to be explained is that the tablets will enhance your mood and you will feel like shit for a short while.

Things will start to get better and these are just the little conversations that aren’t happening right now and it just isn’t really good is it?

It’s not like you have a bad throat and they give you antibiotics. With a GP I totally understand that they are a “general practitioner” and not all of them have a fantastic approach to mental health.

However if you call up and are seeking help like that it should trigger something. If they can’t help, why not refer you to mental health team?

The Cwm Taf Health Board have a mental health crisis team who do some fantastic work and the more research I do, the more amazing services I find but that’s through my own search. How come I’ve had to dig for all that? Even if the doctor said “I can’t go too much into it but the meds will do x, y and z. Here’s a number for this organisation who will give you further support and are happy to help.”

It’s just utilising the services that are already there and to know they’re not being promoted or advertised as much as they should is just mind boggling to be perfectly honest. Yes, there’s a lockdown on and our health services do fantastic work even in these stretched and challenging times.

I’m very aware and respectful of the work they do and I’ve never mentioned the practice or the GP that I had my bad experience with. I never ever want any heat towards them as it’s not the individual that needs to change, it’s the system. I just want the higher levels to take note and make more of an effort strategically to try and put this message out there.

For example, the Welsh Government said that they’ve given £20million to mental health services and I’d challenge that by asking where has it been spent? What’s the evidence that it’s being used as something like a radio ad or social media campaign doesn’t cost the world but it gets peoples attention.

You can target areas with a ready made marketing tool which would help so many people and create a better environment.
I know people who’ve had excellent care from GPs.

Some to the point where the doctor has called them once a week to check in on them and continued to monitor how the medication is effecting a person. Like it can effect you diet and other ways but I’ve never had a medication review. How is that slipping through the net? It shouldn’t be like that for something that so many people experience.

I was so pleased with the way that both news pieces came across as it was just as I wanted to it be. Just like I’ve explained to you and with the BBC report, the reporter spoke to me beforehand and explained that they were speaking to MIND and the health board. They weren’t just going to treat it as Luke having a bad experience with a GP so they’d go and hammer them.

Instead they used the bad experience to highlight exactly what I wanted and that’s the bigger picture and what needs to be done. You always worry if what I say gets taken out of context as they speak to you for an hour and they only use a few minutes on the telly.

Thankfully both were incredible and the ITV one even went to put the case to the Health Minister, Vaughan Gething. This is the reality of lockdown and what services are doing. I wanted to know what the Minister would do about it but I knew he’d give a pretty shit answer. He’s going to dodge it with a politicians answer and sadly he did but loads of people saw it and that’s the first thing people said was that he was very lazy with his answer.

That is starting a conversation and sorry to do a shameless plug but that’s exactly what I want to do. If you don’t talk about it and get people involved you can’t get these changes done. The more we do, the more of a difference we can make.

How important is music to you, especially in difficult situations?

Music has been everything to me since I can remember really. I also think it’s masked a lot of my mental health issues for a long time to be perfectly honest. Growing up and being in bands, feeling a part of a tight knit group, touring and being creative is just incredible.

For me, there’s no better feeling than being up on stage with your friends and playing a gig to a crowd. Having the reaction from the audience is my favourite thing to do and it just fantastic. I’ve loved doing it for many years and will do so for many more to come.

Due to the lockdown it’s hits home big time that not only do I miss it but I realise just how big it is to me in my life. It’s unbelievable just how much of a gap it leaves when you can’t play or go to gigs. It really hits home just how much it means to you.

Aside from gigs, music is a massive part of my life in other aspects. If I’m feeling a bit low or bored, I’ll plug my guitar in or and play loudly. Same if I chuck an album or a playlist on but I’ll warn my partner and my kids that things will get loud for a bit so Dad can rock out!

The main theme is that music most definitely helps me so much through difficult times. The buzz you get from it is nearly indescribable from a playing standpoint. Of course there’s so many people like yourself who miss going to gigs and it shows that so music can get you through anything.

Whether that’s a live setting or listening to a steaming site or a record, it’s massive.
I love putting my headphones on when I’m out for a walk. The good thing with sites like Spotify is that you can shuffle playlists so you can get through so much music. You can find so much on there like I’ve discovered Swedish pop artists through there which I never really listened to before, but I’ve grown to love them. It’s so uplifting along with other Scandinavian artists.

I do lots of talks in my job via the college I work at with health and social care students. What I tell them that music is essential from such a young age. Like children can learn the cues and moods from a happy song. In play school they have songs for breakfast and lunch. It’s engrained into us from such a young age and as we get older it really is the soundtrack to our lives.

When we’re teenagers, something like the emo scene was such a relatable and poignant period for teenagers. You saw bands have songs with lyrics about their struggles and you couldn’t help but relate to that and it was so important to this very day.

If you do like creative writing, that whole scene was something else. Bands like My Chemical Romance, Funeral For A Friend, The Blackout and so many others were essential listening. The content was so good and what a time it was to be part of that scene.

I loved emo music to listen to but couldn’t write it. I grew up in a funky, soul kind of household. Like the band I was in called Cornerstone had a saxophone player and we were so off the cuff compared to the bands we knew and loved but it’s what we knew.

There was one gig in Merthyr where we were on the bill with Kids In Glass Houses and The Blackout and that difference was felt that night for sure.

The feedback we got was that it was funky but in comparison it wasn’t very good. Being in Cornerstone was different but it’s what we loved doing. Some people ask why didn’t we make it? We didn’t because we weren’t making the right songs and we were swimming in the wrong direction.

We did have a really following and it felt good and looking back I’m very proud of it. After that I played in a pop/indie band called OK and we played gigs like the Big Weekend in Cardiff. We were on the same billing as Funeral For A Friend and Attack Attack which was massive to me. We were proper indie pop, and playing to a ‘Smash Hits’ type of audience of emo kids.

You can only play what you’re comfortable with and playing in front of thousands of people is mind blowing. Sharing a tent with bands you look up to is crazy but further proof just how much I love doing it so I have so many great memories to look back on.

It gives me such a buzz. I still do a little bit of original stuff on my own but mainly I’m in a covers band named Noughts and Crosses with my brother. At first it was a bit soul destroying playing Snow Patrol for the 500th time but eventually I realised we were good and getting a really positive reaction from the crowds.

Going back to what I said before, it really puts in perspective just how much I miss playing and there’s such a good feeling that comes from a live setting. That’s a gripe and it feels like a job as we play parties and weddings but it’s so good and really fun to do. I wish it gets back to normal soon because I and so many others miss it.

It’s so beneficial especially with something like mental health because you’re expressing yourself or relating to something creative and meaningful. Like I said there’s very few things than can replicate that and I don’t know where I’d be without music.

What are the main goals that you wish to achieve with the campaigning?

I just think that while I feel well and confident, I just want to talk about mental health as much as possible. That and I want to help people understand that it’s a transient thing.

As I’ve spoken about many times, I was clinically depressed and it’s the lowest I’ve ever been in my life, but as you get to those lows you can get to some amazing high points too. You might dip again but there’s sustained periods of mental health where you feel good and that’s something I really want to push as I feel it isn’t covered as much as it should be.

I know we talk about it more openly but not the actual illnesses. I’m all for the “it’s ok to not be ok” message but at the same time you want to get deeper into it. You want to say to people, here’s the places and support you can go to get help and put more substance behind it.

Little memes and things are good don’t get me wrong but having a person behind it and someone to talk to is just something completely different in terms of being beneficial. To speak to someone trustworthy and willing to let you be open is massive so to focus on that more is something I really want to do.

I also want to push the social aspect more. Of course we’re in a lockdown right now but things get better I want to do more social activities like a ‘Wellness Wednesday Walk’. I’m a strong believer in community spirit and doing something that for a positive thing will help. Especially those who don’t really have anyone to talk to.

I’m lucky to have an amazing partner, family and friends as a really strong support network but not everybody does. Having that extra thing in a community setting is huge as you can come along on your own and there will be someone in the same boat as you.

You can have a chat but also give your legs a workout on a walk so you’re benefitting yourself both physically and mentally. That feeling of being in a community is special too as you bond with people and that feeling of loneliness goes away.

It’s an exciting prospect and people are engaging with me on the page and hopefully it’ll take off once the climate allows us to.

What do you wish was more well known about mental health?

I suppose that the way some employers look at it needs to be addressed. I mean who’s going to ring up saying that they’re depressed in order to fake a sick day? If someone’s reaching out, it’s taken a lot for them to do and that could be them suffering from anxiety, depression, PTSD or any other form of mental illness.

I don’t like people thinking that others would use it for their own gain. A lot of information is easily accessible via a click of a button but employers need to be more aware of these delicate situations. By being more aware and having that education you can support people a lot more.

I’m lucky that I work for a college and they are amazing with me. They’re so helpful and my boss is a legend where I can feel like I can speak to someone and it hasn’t been an issue. Over the past few years sadly I’ve lost grandparents both passed away in a short space of time and work were so supportive.

If I needed a bit more time off, it was never an issue. Even though I had bereavement leave, they told me to take all the time I needed. Of course I needed a doctors note which is easy enough to do but unlike my former employers my current ones are incredibly supportive.

My former employers weren’t helpful at all. They were awful, they hounded me and put me in a disciplinary after coming back from being on the sick. It was all because someone has seen me smiling in a picture on Facebook which had been taken whilst I was off.

Their argument was that I couldn’t have been depressed because I was smiling which is fucking ridiculous. How can you punish someone for smiling? Also now that I look back on it, the photo in question shows that I’m smiling but I felt so low at the time, it’s a forced smile if anything. It was an awful day and someone asked for a pic of me and my brother so I just went with it.

I never did that job the same after that period. From there on I looked for another job and felt the bridges were burned. If you feel you can trust the place you work at to help you in these difficult times then they’re not worth your time as an employee. We’ve come so far and to feel like a number is just shit.

You have to show concern and empathise with someone. If you get a sick note it shows you’re unwell but some industries will pull your pants down to make you feel like you’re worth nothing unless you’re in work. Much more education is needed across the board as so many other people have said the same and employers definitely need to be more understanding.

What else do you find helpful in overcoming difficult situations?

Exercise is a great one for me and it needs to be promoted more as a broad way of coping with difficult situations. Like you don’t have to be a Cross Fit addict with chiselled abs or one of those Peloton trainers you see on telly either. You can alienate so many people with that approach.

The first time I walked into a gym I was in such a bad place both physically and mentally. I was the heaviest I’d ever been where I couldn’t do just one press up. Luckily for me the gym I went to had just opened up so they were very nurturing in the way they were with me.

It saved my life as it gave me a spark that I didn’t know that I needed. They’ve cottoned on to exercise and it does benefit you by releasing those endorphins gives you a massive boost. Whether it’s a gym session or going for a walk, it will do you the world of good and I highly recommend it.

Another is the social aspect. Even with things like this blog chat, connecting with people is massive. My tip is to understand what makes you happy. Do what you love and some days you’ll feel low but on the days you don’t, the feeling is fantastic when you’re doing something you love.

I advocate talking, but have fun with it as well. There’s lots of things you can try and a lot of them might not be for you. You won’t know what’s for you until you give it a go.

What would you say to someone who is struggling and doesn’t know if talking about it is the right thing to do?

I would say talking has always been a positive experience. Whether it’s given me a positive outlet or a new connection with a friend that I haven’t spoken about that type of thing before, it will be good for you.

Even if I’ve shared a Facebook status or tweeted something, I’ve never had any bad feedback from it. Some of the stuff I’ve shared has been really close and personal and I’ve thought against sharing it but the outpouring of love and support is a huge boost.

If people don’t have the confidence to do that, there’s amazing services like SHOUT where you can text that word to 86258 for help and you’ll speak to someone who’ll support you.

Whatever you do, try to talk to someone whether it’s a friend, family member or professional. By doing so it’s benefiting you and by many examples we’ve seen, it can and will save your life.

I think it’s fair to say that Luke has most definitely gone into this with tremendous ambition and desire. Not only to share his story but to help others as well as challenge the stigmas and challenges we face on a daily basis with mental health.

He’s put himself out there which is a great and brave thing to do especially when it comes to appearing on TV. Many people wouldn’t feel comfortable doing it but he knows that by doing so he’s spreading that message on a National scale. Full credit goes to him for doing so.

If you don’t speak up and highlight these issues, you won’t see any changes happen. Regarding the medication and treatment offered by GPs, like Luke said there are loads of fantastic doctors out there but there are cases which show that more can be done.

If they aren’t sure about what to do in terms of support, offer the amazing services and organisations that are out there. Yes medication can help, but there’s so much to it than that. Hopefully this will change in the near future and with people like Luke speaking up, I’m sure it will happen sooner rather than later.

I’ve only really got to know him these past few weeks but we’ve got mutual friends and like the same type of music. He’s a cracking bloke and judging by the conversation I had with him for this blog post, you’d swear I’d known him for 20 years.

His campaigning is detailed as it is passionate. I highly recommend you check out his page on Facebook as he doesn’t do this half hearted. He’s 100% the real deal with this type of thing and I’m sure many people will find his content relatable and educational.

It’s great to see someone with so much passion with mental health campaigning. He definitely goes onto a list with the other fantastic advocates I’ve spoken to and the many others out there who do incredible work.

His passion for music is also great to see. I remember seeing him play as part of OK at Cardiff’s Big Weekend and I remember listening to Cornerstone back in the day as well. Next opportunity I’ll get to see him play live, I will as I’d love to go to a gig as I’m sure so many others want to as well!

I’ve shared information below to Luke’s page for ‘Start The Conversation’ as well as the links to the new reports as well as his socials for himself and the music side of things. I wish him nothing but the best as he goes forward in everything that he does and it’s great to see another one of the good guys out there doing amazing work.

A massive thank you goes to Luke and everyone who’s taken time to read this. Hope everyone is doing ok and if you ever feel the need to have a chat, my DM’s are open.

Hope you’re well, stay safe, take care and until next time don’t think of this as a goodbye but more of a see you later!

Start The Conversation
Facebook page – www.facebook.com/StartTheConversationWales/

News reports – https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-56087135

www.itv.com/news/wales/2021-02-24/gp-referrals-for-mental-health-support-drop-during-coronavirus-pandemic-as-people-are-reluctant-or-unable-at-get-help?fbclid=IwAR1pZwZKAa5c2pQXNDD-mQaYC1ZAJwfcDL2SA7vmm1C_vCdrT60jFJkdcRM

Luke’s Music Pages
www.facebook.com/LegoManMusic/
www.facebook.com/NoughtsCrossesBand/

Luke’s Social Pages
Twitter – @LukeRhysJones

Instagram – @legoman88

One thing I’ve learned from doing this blog post is that backing yourself is a massive benefit, especially if you really want to do something you feel passionate about.

If you don’t, you’re only holding yourself back. I held off posting my initial blog post out of the fear of what other people would think. After coming to a point where I knew that I was stopping myself from being creative and from holding back something I was passionate about, I posted it and haven’t regretted it since.

Confidence isn’t an easy thing to get but step by step it builds up to the point where you feel like you could take on the world in some senses and it’s an incredible feeling.

I’d like to think that the person I’ve spoken to for this week’s blog post fits that narrative perfectly. I first met David Jones through a friend a good few years ago and instantly thought what a nice guy.

The more I got to know him, the more I realised how much he loves fitness and going to the gym. So much to the fact he’s now started his own YouTube channel called ‘David’s Challenges’ where he puts himself out of his comfort zone but in situations he knows he would cope in.

It took a long time for David to reach this level of confidence. He explained to me over a chat on Zoom, what experiences and feelings led to him to follow his passions.

How important is a detailed exercise and fitness regime in order to maintain a healthy mindset?

I wouldn’t say that you have to be 100% strict with it to keep that healthy mindset. What is important is to just stay consistent with it really. Like if you fall off the horse and have a bit of time away from it, it’s not the end of the world.

As long as you get back on it at some point and maintain a level of consistency, it’s always going to benefit you. It’s the same with eating as if you have a cheat meal or a weekend where you treat yourself, that’s ok. If you get back onto the diet plan or just a case of healthy eating on the Monday, that’s perfectly normal.

If anything it gives you a routine as well as a goal or purpose. By doing well with exercise or eating well in the week, that cheat meal is the target to aim for. You’ll feel like you’ve earned it and that’s what we go for when we train or diet, you’re self rewarding by getting fitter and healthier, so a cheat meal is definitely a well earned treat.

You feel much better as the endorphins get going. Of course you’re getting in better shape, not just physically but mentally. Even just with a 10 minute workout, you feel like you’ve achieved something as you’ve put in the work. The more you keep at it, the more positive you’ll feel about yourself.

It does build your confidence. You’re body is changing and the physical transformation is uplifting. Especially if people are complimenting you as that nice thing that someone says could make your day that extra bit special.

If you eat junk food and that all the time it can lead to things like depression. But a change of diet and just getting out there for something like a walk is really beneficial. Especially to get that change of mindset going from a negative one to a much more positive one for sure.

You’ve mentioned how your past inspires you as you’ve gone forward in life. How exactly does that give you the drive and ambition you need?

In the past, I quite often stopped myself from doing certain things as I’d worry what would people think about me if I did them.

For example, I went to a badminton class in the local sports centre. I would often worry that someone I know would see me as unlike Football, Rugby etc not many people play badminton. Little things like that would worry me, as although there’s nothing wrong with playing that sport, i was kind of different from “the norm” I suppose.

The same would go for meetings or job interviews as I’d be scared to speak up incase people thought of me in a different way. I kind of relish that sort of environment now as I appreciate and like the challenge a lot more. It’s a great way of approaching these things as even though I’m nervous, I know with the right confidence and preparation, you can achieve anything.

I don’t have any regrets now. The only way I would feel that way is if I didn’t do something or didn’t give it my best shot. Self doubt and confidence is a massive thing which stems from childhood, especially my school days.

Self admittedly I am quite short and I was picked on a bit in school for it. I also wasn’t the sharpest tool in the box either and got bulkier quite a bit as a result. It got to a point where I thought these people aren’t going to like you, so just be yourself and move on from them as they’re not people I wanted to associate myself with.

In school, I stayed out of people’s ways and did my own thing. Now it’s a bit different as I feel more confident to stand up for myself or speak my mind if the situations presents an opportunity to, whereas before I wouldn’t have out of the fear of judgement and ridicule to be honest.

I used to hate confrontation and I’d back down in any of those type of situations. About 10 years ago, I just decided I had enough of feeling like I wasn’t confident enough to go for things and speak up. I had ideas and beliefs which help certain situations and now it’s good not to dwell and move forward.

It was of course a great decision on my part as I feel so much better for doing it. It’s all about backing yourself and by going forward with a positive mindset you can achieve anything really.

What led you to start your own YouTube channel and what sort of response have you had?

I always watch YouTube channels which focus on fitness. I’m fans of people like Steve Cook and Christian Guzman who have millions of subscribers on their channels as well as a massive following on social media.

They inspired me to start it as like me they’ve done it from scratch. I spoke to a colleague who said that I should go for it but mainly it was my fiancée Jenna who gave me a massive boost of encouragement to start this project up.

She believed in me and supported me all the way through. There’s been days where I feel like I’m not getting to where I want, but she give me the reassurance that these things take time. It proves that perseverance is key to these sort of things and having a strong support network is massive in doing so.

In my case it’s Jenna who is my support network and she pushes me to do better things with the channel. She saw that I had the ambition to start this up, and to have her encouragement is massive the more I go forward with the channel.

Just putting content out where people feel comfortable watching it and enjoy or have a laugh is what I want from this channel. I’m doing it for entertainment and also an educational aspect. If I find something that’s benefitting me in a training or dieting aspect,

I’d share that as some people would find that helpful, but also encourage people who’re using a similar technique to carry on with it as well.

The response I’ve had is surprising as it is incredible. Going back to the very first video, in the first hour I had 30 views and 10 or 20 days later I had 20 subscribers which was so surprising. It shocked that people would be interested in what I had to say or do by subscribing to me. They’d get notifications when I’d post a video and that support is massive.

As a result of the videos, I’m an ambassador for Fab Activewear. I wear some of their stuff in the videos and them reaching out to me was a huge thing indeed. The more you put yourself out there, the more rewards you’ll get.

I don’t have a particular goal with this so I’m not putting a cap on this. The sky’s the limit and even though the lockdown has had a bit of a hit on this, I do have ambitions to take the videos on the road or in classes. Things like MMA training is something I want to do as it shows different ways of training that the people watching may want to try as a result.

Again this is something even like a ballet class. I’m not afraid of taking myself out of my comfort zone and looking to see what the benefits are in these type of environments. If someone finds it helpful that shows the videos are working as well as getting my own creative juice flowing.

Why do you think there is such a stigma associated with mental health, specifically with men?

I think it’s that men have been perceived as tough. They’re not supposed to cry and show any emotions or weakness. That’s where the stigma comes from but especially in my case with Jenna, women and other loved ones want us to open up.

It’s ok to have these feelings as they’re perfectly normal. Nobody can go through life without a certain point where we go through a difficult period. It’s hard with the stigma around mental health and that men feel this shame that if we do open up, we’re seen as weak.

From another personal perspective, my brother has struggled with his mental health for a few years now. He’s refused to speak to anyone or go to the doctors. Even counselling is something he doesn’t feel comfortable using as he sits in the house without using social networks.

It’s a very isolated environment as my brother’s case shows. That mindset is crippling in a way as it does hold you back so much moving forward in your life. You end up in a state where you don’t enjoy things as all but also you don’t have that confidence to step forward to be more open due to that stigma.

I wouldn’t say it’s a generational thing but social media has contributed massively towards things like anxiety and depression. Not just men but women and children too. Back in the 90’s and early 2000’s, it wasn’t around as life was more active especially as a child. You were out more but now it’s totally different.

You hardly heard about people struggling because conversations were more prominent. Social media has paid a major part in the downturn in these things as negative body opinions have occurred due to the fitness models and other mainstream media outlets pushing out photoshopped or airbrushed photos.

It isn’t beneficial in a lot of ways as people especially youngsters are very impressionable. My advice would be that even though I’m not in the best shape, I don’t see myself as anything but myself. When I get to where I want to be, I know that it’s due to my hard work and because I wanted to do it.

A huge message I want to send from my videos is that you make the changes that you want to make. Don’t feel pressured, it’s your body and do want you want to do with it. There’s no toxic influence with me or what I do, so why should you feel you need to take it on board?

Back yourself, know your worth and by going forward you’ll thank yourself for doing so.

What’s the biggest thing that you’ve learned since starting your journey?

If you’re going to do something, go for it. Don’t be scared as on reflection, if I didn’t go through with the You Tube channel and other choices that I’m glad that I’ve made, I know I’d massively regret it.

I’m glad I started when I did. You won’t know if you try and if you fail, it’s fine. You learn from these things, take them on board and we go again. I’d rather do something, fail and learn from it as it builds character. We learn from our mistakes as we take them board for self improvement.

It all goes back to when I started to learn to drive. I failed my theory so many times that I almost gave up in trying. I never did though, I kept going after the 4 or 5 times I failed but in the end I passed it. You get that chance to win at certain things with perseverance and ambition. If you put the work in, you’ll smash it.

Reflection is also massive. I always use that in terms of the choices I’ve made in life whether it’s what friends I have in life, the jobs I’ve done and other things. Taking time out to assess yourself is key. Quite often you realise a change needs to be made or you know what’s benefitting you so you focus on those things. Reflection is a key path in order to do that for sure.

Aside from exercise, what do find helpful in overcoming difficult or stressful situations?

To be honest, I don’t do this as often as I should but meditation is really helpful. Usually before bed or first thing when I get up, just giving myself 5 or 10 minutes to sit there, close my eyes and focus on my breathing is such a positive and beneficial thing to do.

It starts or ends the day perfectly for me as I’m sure it does for so many other people. It helps create a positive mindset and definitely clears out the cobwebs or any overthinking that you find is going on in your mind.

The last thing you want is to start the day or end it in a state where your mind is going 100mph and just giving yourself that time to relax is key.

I came across it by accident as you see celebrities trying it. I’ve read that they say it improves people going forward in terms of starting the day and avoiding that spiral of doubt and your mind racing away. Before bed it’s the same after a stressful day.

Your mind goes awake when you want to go asleep. Concentrating on your breathing for 5 minutes and the positive things in your life is essential in helping you grow as a person. I know it’s not for everyone but for it’s helped and I wouldn’t knock it until you try it for sure.

Taking some to myself and having a game on the PlayStation takes my mind off stressful things like work. It breaks the day up as well but also it’s something I enjoy. Hobbies and interests are key and if that puts you in your comfort zone, do it.

Same goes for walking. If I’m in a bad mood or stressed, a bit of fresh air does wonders for the mind as it does for the legs. There’s so many things to help you get through these tough times. As long as it’s constructive, you won’t regret it.

What would you say to someone who is struggling and doesn’t know if talking about is the right thing to do?

The best thing to do is to always talk about it. Whether that’s your partner, family members or friends, people are there who care about you. Same goes if it’s a professional as many people find it easier to speak to someone they don’t know.

Your closest friends and family will be there for you no doubt. Talking about the issues, will get the weight off your shoulders. If you don’t, it can build up and come out in toxic ways. You’d only be benefitting yourself for talking to someone.

Like I said earlier, there’s no shame in admitting that you’re struggling with something. We’re only human and a lot of us do care about each other even in the difficult times.

A support network is key. Jenna is mine and she’s believed in me from when we first got together. It’s overwhelming but it’s massive. She’s the best thing that ever happened to me and proof that opening yourself to be happy will end the right way.

I’m very pleased that things have gone so well for David. He’s always come across as a nice guy and all the positive things going on in his life are thoroughly deserved. I’m glad he and his fiancée Jenna are happy together and the support they give each other is a joy to see.

He like so many of us has had a tough journey to get to where he is now and he is certainly proving the doubters wrong. Self belief is key and I know that myself as I had massive doubts about starting my blog but I did it. Same goes for David as he backed himself and it’s paying off massively in the year that he’s been doing the YouTube channel.

By realising his own self worth and that he could achieve these things builds a good character and he most definitely has that.

The ambition he has with the channel again goes back to the “control your narrative” mindset I often talk about. If you believe in yourself and put in the work, anything is possible.

I wish David nothing but the very best going forward and I hope lots of success with the channel occurs as he puts so much work in, and deserves to reap the rewards.

I’ve posted the link to his channel as well as his Instagram page for anyone wants to take a look. I’m not a fitness fanatic by any means but they’re entertaining as they are educational and the amount of work he’s put in is clear to see.

Massive thanks goes to David for speaking to me and also to anyone who has a read of this post. If you want to do something creative, embrace that side of you and go for it.

Take care, stay safe and until next time don’t think of this as a goodbye but more of a see you later!

YouTube Channel – youtube.com/channel/UCzFx3VLukQKp6VEBZtbWehw

Instagram – @davidschallenges

Ever since I was diagnosed with anxiety and depression, there’s many advocates and organisations that I’ve either been directed towards or come across myself which have offered a great amount of guidance.

These have been incredibly helpful during my journey to understanding why I feel the way that I do and how I can achieve a much healthier mindset. The help I’ve found across all platforms also has helped me understand that no matter what way of life we lead, we all have our struggles and it’s ok to admit that we do.

One of those organisations was Heads Above The Waves. I originally came across them last year whilst chatting to past blog interviewee Alicia Ewington. I looked them up and found them incredibly passionate and detailed in their approach.

They’ve recently celebrated their 8th birthday and are growing from strength to strength on a daily basis. It was set up in 2013 by Si Martin and Hannah Morgan who simply wanted to make a difference.

By setting up HATW they, wanted to share their journeys and to let others know that we’re never alone. The growth of the organisation since then is impressive as it is inspiring and I myself can honestly say it’s helped me.

Their website is a fantastic hub of helpful tips, articles and other incredible content to help us with our journeys. Their online store is also filled with so many t shirts, hoodies, notebooks and other incredible merchandise which helps promote that positive message.

I recently sat down with Si for a chat via Zoom to speak about what inspired him and Hannah to set up HATW and what else drives him in the organisation. He also speaks about his love for music as he’s the drummer for one of my favourite pop punk bands in Junior.

I couldn’t thank him enough for taking the time out of his busy schedule in order to speak to me and I thoroughly enjoyed our chat.

What inspired you to start HATW and what challenges did you face in doing so?

The original plan stemmed from my first job out of university which was with a communications company. One of our clients was a charity named UnLTD which funds social enterprises.

I was speaking to someone at work and mentioned that I’d struggled as a teenager with my mental health and had a really bad time with it. I also had a particular bad experience with self harming as a harmful coping mechanism. By getting into pop punk music and playing drums was something which helped me massively along with everything which came with it.

That was the thing which led me to making more friends when I was a bit of a loner and the more I played drums, the better I got at it. I then became the kid in that band which led towards the opportunities and the point of where I’m at now.

During my teenage years, my sister gave me the number for Samaritans but I didn’t really think that I was important enough for them. I just thought that in comparison to what you read about, this was just me having a rubbish time and I’d be wasting their time. In retrospect, I’ve since realised that my thinking back then was a load of rubbish and of course they would have wanted to help me.

The original idea I had was inspired by my love of pop punk. I set out a plan where we’d sell merch for my band with the tagline “pop punk saved my life”. The proceeds from the merch would then go to Samaritans and encourage their work.

Someone at the comms company which I was working at said that I should put in for a grant with Unlimited as it would help me make that idea into something real. I thought to myself “why not?” and went for it. They told me that it was a lovely idea to use merch as a way of starting conversations but we’d only find you if you set up your own charity instead of supporting an already established one like Samaritans.

At first I was a bit taken aback by it but then drove forward with the idea. I ended up chatting to a few people around me such as Hannah who also runs Team Up! and our friend Gruff who in the first instance runs a terrific production company named Storm and Shelter. Gruff left shortly after to focus on the growth of Storm and Shelter. We all grouped together to set up what is now Heads Above The Waves

The three of us started off with the website and had about three merch designs which we took around in a suitcase wherever we could. We wanted to start conversations and be what we all wanted to have when we were struggling in our younger years and still do to this very day.

What inspired HATW I suppose is a long way of saying that a particular crummy aspect of my personal life and the idea of someone going through a similar thing that I did, then it’s ok and we can get through it. More-so it’s being that help that we wanted to be there and show that we’re in this together and in this for the long run.

In regards to challenges, I suppose the biggest one was that we didn’t set out to start an organisation so everything seemed to be a challenge at the beginning. I think there were a couple of things like boring red tape stuff and self doubt which still exists to this day.

It’s almost like a form of imposter syndrome where I feel like I don’t know what I’m doing or why I’m here. This is something which is on of the biggest problems there is on a personal level. However having these conversations about mental health is what we want to do and build a sort of database from these experiences and conversations to help us going forward.

Over time you’d build a plethora of information which will help people over all walks of mental health so we just don’t focus on one particular aspect. Quite similar to what you’re doing with the blog, it’s all about growth and that’s a challenge but a really enticing one at the same time.

We all have our own stories and the conversations will be different and similar in their own particular ways. Both aspects would be most helpful to someone seeking that help and between that and our own journeys, it’s just about helping to spread that all important message that you’re not alone and it’s ok to talk about these kind of things.

Since HATW began back in 2013, what do you feel is the biggest thing you’ve learned?

I’m going to go for a sneaky answer on this by saying that we have learned a lot but in the form of little things that have all come together to help us in our journey. Maybe the big answer is that it’s ok to make mistakes. You can learn a lot from them and grow as a result.

The very first batch of T-shirts that we did, there was a design which we had that when it was mocked up, it looked amazing. It went right to the edge of the shirt but of course when you’re screen printing a T shirt, the screen is big on a set size.

Like the design would look amazing on a small when taken right to the edge of the shirt but when you have a XXL t shirt it doesn’t look as good as the design wouldn’t go to edge. We didn’t take that into account and didn’t realise until the shirts had been printed. However, like I said it’s all part of the learning experience.

There’s a whiteboard in our office which is massive. It must be 7 or 8 feet tall. It’s my fault as I didn’t measure it properly when I ordered it and thought it would be a perfect size. It ended up being unable to send back so we’re stuck with it. I’m 6ft and even I have to stand on a box sometimes to write stuff on it. Honestly it haunts me at times!

There’s lots of situations where there’s lots of consideration and thoughts that go into the stuff that we put out. We have to make sure it’s not harmful, not rushed and thought through. I guess it’s risk assessment but it’s ok to put something which we can adapt, learn and grow from it.

I was saying the other day that the vlog content that we put out on the Heads website and socials has grown so much in the 15 months or so since we did the first video post. The most recent one is such a stark contrast as the more videos I did, the more I learned from both external and internal inputs.

Things like including subtitles for the videos were little things that we’ve picked up along the way and learning from your mistakes is key in making sure you adapt and overcome any setbacks. Being thoughtful in what advice you take is also something massive we’ve learned over the years as well.

To an extent, even in the mental health world there’s no point in assuming what people want. You have to stay with the times as you could end up being a bit contradictory. Like you could people if they’d like to see us release a green T-shirt or a red one. 50% might say it has to be green and the other half may say red and then you’re stuck on what to do.

The answer of course is to make a red and a green shirt. That might be a bit of a lame example but you learn from little things like that. Instead of putting yourself on the spot, think of the bigger picture as sometimes two ideas can be merged together and self doubt may creep in but it’s all about responding to it.

Music is heavily associated with the organisation. How important is it to you, especially in overcoming difficult situations?

It’s hugely important dude. We may be a little bit biased in terms of us coming from an alternative scene, which we’re still a part of. I think particularly in that scene, there’s a huge sense of identity and a strong community feel as well.

I think in our own world it’s extra important and very special but at the same time a similar thing can be said for someone listening to house music. It’s might not be my cup of tea but for someone else who does enjoy it, by listening to it they could feel more relaxed or motivated and overall in a much better place.

For me personally, there’s a real connection when I play drums. My brain goes a million miles a minute at times so to just concentrate on what my four limbs are doing at one time is amazing for my mental state. I’m very bad at expressing anger and frustration at all and to let anything out for 20 mins or half hour playing drums is a massive release for me.

Like I said, playing and making music and getting into those scenes has caused me to make friends, which led to opportunities and experiences I’ve had which is just incredible and gives me an incredible feeling which I’ve had since I was a teenager.

There’s a Gnarwolves song named ‘Community, Stability, Identity’ and it sums the feeling up quite nicely. Music can give you a sense of community which can give a sense of identity and help you feel like you have a place where you belong as a Punk Rock dude. This would lead hopefully to some stability where you’re comfortable with who you are.

This could be by going to concert and losing yourself in the music, putting on your headphones and chilling to your favourite record. I also think music is incredibly powerful in terms of dictating and reacting to your mood. For me, I have playlists where it starts really heavy so if I’m angry I’ll listen to that as it has a bit of aggression in it.

As the playlist goes on, it’ll go more towards bands like Underoath who’re heavy but with a positive spin. The Slipknot song named ‘Pulse of the Maggots’ is a prime example as its vintage Slipknot as its got heavy riffs and aggression but it’s really positive as I won’t be wasting potential. That speaks to me and in a way inspires me to pick up my mood to a more positive one.

I suppose its like a journey for me with really heavy and angry songs, then lean towards heavy but less angry and finish with less heavy more positive songs. Going through that also helps me remember that I’m a huge believer in that if you don’t have the words for something, there’s always a song for it.

By putting on an album, it’s a fine way of defining your mental state or expressing how you’re feeling. That can be done lyrically as well as that connection with someone on the other end of the speaker. Like when I was 14 and Taking Back Sunday releasing songs in which the lyrics summed up how I was feeling and that was massive to me.

The song ‘Elevated’ by State Champs is a huge one for me too. I remember a few years ago, I stuck that on instead of listening to sad music and the lyrics stood out in a massive way. Basically telling us that we can achieve a state of mind that everything’s going to be ok and doing so through music is the best way to do it.

When it seems that a song is about one thing but it turns to be about something else is where you really bond with a song, album or artist. That’s the other cool thing as well as music and lyrics are open to interpretation. We can both listen to that State Champs song and take similar or different things from it. That’s what music does it’s so wide open and helpful in different ways.

The discover and journey it can take you on is massive. You can discover some cool stuff and what Machine Gun Kelly is doing with his pop punk album may help fans of that genre to listen to his rap albums. It can open a window to a genre you’d never have listened to before, so it’s kinda like an all you can eat buffet of music. There’s so much out there.

In general, music and gigs has the power to bring thousands of people together in this shared experience. Music is like one of the most important things to humanity in general. I know it’s a big statement but you look at all of the examples and there’s very few things that can replicate the feelings that music brings and it’s just incredible man.

You’ve done a lot of work in schools and other public platforms. What response have you found from the workshops, especially from children and young adults?

The summarised answer to that question is that around 90% of children that we survey feel better equipped to deal with their issues after going through our school workshops. The other kind of interesting thing is that that as a whole, our approach to speak to them is better than other things they’ve had in the past.

Now this isn’t a case of us slagging off anyone else, and I don’t want to do that at all. There’s so many fantastic organisations out there doing great work and it’s just down to finding the right one for you.

I think our approach of going and saying that we’re not medical professionals, we’ve gone through some really rubbish times in our lives. We’ve gathered these stories and coping mechanisms together and we’re here to share them with you. We just want to be that means of support that we didn’t have and speak like we wanted to be spoken to. That’s how we’d speak to them.

That’s the thing that most people connect with as we’re not talking down to them. We’re not using medical jargon, basically we’re saying “it sucks” whilst offering support and advice at the same time. The other thing is that we quite often end up with effects we didn’t imagine having beforehand.

There’s a few occasions where we did 4 or 5 weeks of workshops and there was one particular student who didn’t really connect with anything we said, or respond to any of the stuff we’ve said. They’re not going to take anything from this and thought we’d let this kid down.

However, the school contacted us a few months later and told us that the student had actually turned a corner and was performing better in their studies. Much better than they had before. They did not engage at all in the sessions but just by having a space to be themselves and open, heard and validated has a profound effect that we don’t necessarily see.

It’s one of the things that I really want to work on going forward with Heads is capturing that and the longer term effect. We put stuff out there and a year down the line, all we’ve done is sewn the seeds and said that there are things you can try and people you can talk to.

It might be that a kid comes away and says that it doesn’t effect them. A year down the line they may be in a different situation where they do need that help and they’ll remember the website so they’d head over to Heads and watch a video, read an article or blog post without it being a super intense thing which would make you feel really uncomfortable.

A positive response which you can grow from is the key and we just want to plant the seeds to help them should they need it at any point.

How important is social media in spreading your message?

It’s very important as one of the things we set out to do with young people is speak to them on their level. Their language that they speak with and converse with is social media, whether that’s getting a positive experience or reach out for support.

The fact that the world is transitioning even in the 8 years that HATW has been going, we’re even starting to slip behind slightly as we’ve only recently signed up to Tik Tok. It’s very much a case of “Gen Z” and beyond as we’re very much in a digital world and we need to meet these people to have the conversations.

It’s all well and good to say that we’re going to run a support group in the shop but the response is that the people would rather have it on Tik Tok or another form of social media then in the long run, at least it’s going to be more effective when and where they need it.

To take it back to when my sister gave me the Samaritans number, I didn’t feel that was something I’d be comfortable with. As I was using MySpace back then and these days it would be Instagram, if someone shares a Heads post with a tagline that says “hey, you’re going to be ok”, I wouldn’t feel comfortable using a helpline but the social media means can be a positive stepping stone.

Perhaps by interacting with this site, I’d feel a bit more open to using a helpline in the future as it would be something I’d feel more comfortable using. By seeing other people’s stories where they had spoken to helplines, maybe it won’t be so bad for me either. The good side of social media can be very crucial, especially in promoting our message of support whether it’s promoting our videos, blog posts or merch.

The merch can be a good conversation starter as one of our sayings is “too rad to stay sad”. By saying that it’s ok but you’re a badass by not staying this way forever. You’re going to get up tomorrow and crush it. If it’s not tomorrow then the day after that because you are sick and you will smash it. YES! GET IN!

What do you wish was more well known about mental health and the stigmas associated with it?

I think we’ve come a really long way in the 8 years that Heads has been up and running. There’s so much more available that’s out there and happening around mental health which is fantastic.

Everything I was thinking of like the usual slogans associated with mental health like “it’s ok to not be ok” springs to mind.

Everyone struggles in varying degrees is another key thing talked about, they don’t need to be more well known but there are meanings and substance behind the cliches and that is very important to realise that it’s not just a saying.

You probably already have things that can help your mental health that you don’t necessarily realise that’s there. These are things like video games. I love playing them and I know the difference between playing them out of boredom to zone out or consciously saying I’m getting worked up or in a negative trail of thought, so I need to switch off.

By switching off I’d be using my love of video games to escape to a “happy place” where I’m doing something I enjoy instead of being in a negative mindset. By wondering around the wilderness of ‘Red Dead Redemption’ or playing ‘Call Of Duty’ for a while will help me unwind.

Doing the things you already enjoy and doing some consciously will aid your mental health. You can watch Disney+ if you’re bored or if you need unleash some emotion, you’ll watch ‘Up’ and have a good old cry. That also works massively and it’s something I harp on about.

You’ve got things in your life that can help you manage your mental health. Maybe you need to find new and specific things as well but in general you probably already do something that has a positive impact on your wellbeing.

What would you say to someone who is struggling and doesn’t know if talking about it is the right thing to do?

In the vast majority of cases it’s much better to talk about it and not keep it in. So, you do you is the way to go but if talking about isn’t the right thing you can try drawing it, putting a playlist together of your favourite songs and many other ways to express yourself.

To find what works for you is essential. Just because talking works for me, it won’t necessarily mean it’ll help you, so try many things and eventually you will find something that will help you.

Like I said in the vast amount of cases, just speaking to someone you know and trust will make it more real. When something is out of your head in a conversation or when it’s written down, it becomes more manageable and tangible.

It doesn’t necessarily have to be talking that can be expressing yourself. All of the other means I’ve spoken about are alternative ways of doing that, and as long as you channel it and take it on via a healthy route, you can help yourself achieve a much more positive mindset for sure.

This is only the second time I’ve spoken to someone from a non profit organisation supporting mental health and on both occasions, I’ve learned so much from the conversations.

The work Si and everyone associated with HATW is incredible. Not just with the merch that helps us start these conversations but also the work they do in schools and other public platforms.

I’d have loved to be a teenager with these types of resources. During my teen years, there were plenty of instances where I struggled and felt like I was in a bit of a rut. Si also struggled and has found the means to set up an organisation which he would have reached out to in his teen years.

I know I’d have probably reached out to HATW if they came to my school. Being a massive fan of punk rock and other alternative sub genres of music, I’d have resonated with their stories and experiences.

Also, you don’t want to be contradicted at any point in life and Heads’ approach is exactly the opposite. I see that in their videos, blog posts and other content. It’s thoughtful, considerate and detailed which is what we all want in an approach to mental health.

Me and Si spoke for just over an hour and it flew by. His love for music and specific cult playing the drums has helped him massively. Once again this proves that music is a saving grace for so many of us. Whether it’s putting your headphones on, singing in the shower or playing an instrument, it does really give us a great feeling that very little other things can do.

A massive congrats goes to Heads Above The Waves on their 8th anniversary. I’m sure they’ll keep growing and offering their incredible support network and techniques whilst adapting to the changing times. They really do capture the positive side of social media and without it, their message wouldn’t really be seen or heard.

Thanks once again to Si for talking to me for the blog. I wish him and everyone at Heads all the best for the future and when it’s safe to do so, I’ll most definitely be popping into the store online and in Cardiff to pick up a few things.

The work the organisation does is nothing short of incredible. What started off as an idea, has blown up into something which has benefitted so many people including myself. Everyone at Heads are incredible advocates for mental health and are essential in tackling the stigmas that surround it.

I’ve left some details about HATW regarding how to access their awesome website, socials and their store when lockdown ends. For fans of music, I’ve also shared details on Junior so if you want to check out their socials or music, the info’s there.

Full kudos and respect to Si, HATW, all us quiet kids who liked a bit of punk rock, metal or any other alternative music genre and anyone else who has their struggles and feels alone at times. Remember we’re never alone in this battle and plenty of people love us for who we are.

Thank you as always for reading. Take care, stay safe and until next time don’t think of this as a goodbye but more of a see you later!

Heads Above The Waves

Website – hatw.co.ukSocial media – @HATW_uk (Twitter)@headsabovethewaves (Instagram)Heads Above The Waves (Facebook)

Si’s Social Media

@Himynameissi (Twitter) @asilverdollar (Instagram)

Junior

Search for “Junior” on Spotify, Apple Music and all other streaming platformsWebsite – musicofjunior.comSocial media – @musicofjunior (Twitter and Instagram), Junior (Facebook)

Being open and honest about your struggles is something I talk about quite often in these blog posts. Myself and the people I’ve spoken to have found ourselves to be more vocal in order to confront our problems although it wasn’t an easy path to do so.

If you do open up to someone, it’s a massive boost. That could be a family member, friend, colleague or a total stranger. Just knowing someone is listening to you and offering you that arm of support is an incredible feeling. It took a lot for me to get to that point but I’m very glad I did.

One of those people I opened up to during my early days of being diagnosed with anxiety and depression is Elizabeth Jones. I’ve known Liz for the best part of 10 years as she’s from the same town as me. She’s one of those naturally friendly people who if you met her, you’d swear she’s known you all your life.

Sadly like many of us, Liz has had her battles with mental health. She’s been on a long road to eventually being diagnosed with ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder) and BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder).

Liz has been incredibly honest about her journey and is always challenging the stigmas surrounding these illnesses via educational posts that she uploads via her social media. She also uses her love of fashion and music to help her through the tough times, which of course she explains in great detail.

I couldn’t thank her enough for sitting down for a chat over a Zoom call. Her message is loud, clear and most definitely inspiring.

You’re very open about your mental health journey. Do you find this to be an easy thing to do?

This is a funny one because I have ADHD, and people who have this tend to be “over-sharers”. Even though people think that I’m very open about my mental health, it’s literally me experiencing “word vomit”.

Basically in my head I know that I shouldn’t be saying it nor do I really want to, but the condition is causing me to say it nonetheless.
It is good now that I reflect on it because I know that awareness can be raised by the amount that I do overshare so it’s very important to find a balance with it.

Sometimes I do find that I’ll dump a lot of my trauma onto someone who hasn’t really asked for it.

It’s a bit like where I’m having a conversation with a person, especially if I’ve had a drink and I tell them a story about something that happened to me without them even asking. At times I think “what the fuck?” when I reflect on it and I’m sure people think the same when I overshare.

They have to process it and I’m sure it’s a lot to take in when someone just unloads that amount of information onto you. That being said it’s really important to be open about things, but you most definitely have to find a balance with it all. Moderation is key.

With that in mind, I just know that if I did have the mindset to know my limits I wouldn’t feel like I’ve overshared. As I’ve mentioned that’s out of my control but through awareness and reflection it’s most definitely helping me be more open about it as well.

I know some people have difficulties in talking just a little bit about their mental health and the issues surround it, I’m the opposite but need to reel it in a little bit. My boyfriend has said that he’s worried that people would see me for my mental illnesses instead of the person I really am because I talk about them so much.

I’m much more than “Liz who has BPD and ADHD” and a past with drugs and alcohol. They don’t really know the real me so I have to find the correct balance. I’m not quite there yet but most definitely more aware of what needs to be done.

It’s an educational process and I feel people should talk about what and when they feel most comfortable. Sharing your life and knowledge is key but finishing that balance is essential. Don’t get consumed by it.

There are are forums and communities that I’m a part of which supports both ADHD and BPD. They’re filled with intelligent and helpful people although in the BPD community I get a lot of people who can be unhealthy. I hate saying this as there’s so many people who want to get better but there are a number of people who don’t want to and using their BPD as an excuse to act a certain way which can be very toxic.

Shitty behaviour can be excused due to mental health conditions to a certain degree but I do feel there’s a level where you need to be accountable for your actions. I’ve learned that the hard way and I know sometimes you can be a dickhead.

Sometimes I can be a bit “much” and that can be overwhelming to my boyfriend.
My triggers can be overwhelming so he can’t understand sometimes. With ADHD, it’s on an opposite end of the mental health spectrum compared to other disorders although certain things can overlap each other.

My BPD can be very intense where I’m very clingy as I fear abandonment. There were times where I’d think he hated me but now with education, reflection as well as being more open about things,. That’s key to understanding each other and we’ve been together a year and we’re growing stronger by the day.

You’ve shared a lot of information about ADHD and BPD via your social media platforms. What’s the biggest things you’ve learned from it?

With the stuff I’ve looked into, I found that ADHD is very rarely diagnosed in women. Obviously I now know I’ve had it for my life but didn’t know until a few years ago. I was diagnosed around 2017 and didn’t expect it but the doctor noticed certain traits which helped them to diagnose me properly.

I didn’t really know what to do but fortunately I had someone with a lot of information to help me as my friend Kez was diagnosed about 10 years ago. It felt weird as I was going through a bit of a breakdown at the time.

It was a weird process and I confided in my friend which was a massive boost for me. She actually said that she had an inkling that something was up as she noticed similar traits that she had. There’s different types of BPD and the other name for it is Emotionally Unstable Personality Disorder. I hate that terminology as it’s spotlighting it more in a negative way and basically saying “hi I’m emotionally unstable.”

It’s almost giving someone a chance to cherry pick at you. This is a thing I hate as there’s so many stigmas as people think you to behave in a certain way which is portrayed in films and TV but it isn’t that way at all. People get it confused with Multiple Personality Disorder when it’s completely different.

I’ve always been quite vacant although I’m very positive and talkative. If anything, before my diagnosis I thought it was a sort of self destructive behaviour whilst not knowing there was something else behind it. At first they thought it was bipolar as there was manic periods then depressive moments which made it look that way.

BDP does get a bad rep and there isn’t as much help for it as other conditions. It’s literally been described as the most painful mental health disorder with highest rates of suicide. A lot of professionals won’t help as it’s so difficult to treat. Not all but in my experiences it’s hard to get help.

It’s most helpful and effective way of treating it is something called DBD (Dialectical Behavioural Therapy) which is helping trauma to the brain. There’s part of your brain which doesn’t process it and unfortunately growing up I did have times where it was traumatic which all went towards my mental health.

It was around that time I switched psychiatrists and it was a huge and beneficial change for me. He was asking me certain questions that I’d never been asked before and seemed more keen to get to the root of the problems which were effecting me. They asked me if I ever thought about the concept of having ADHD as just by watching me, he could see I was displaying symptoms of it.

I can never sit still, fidgeting and it was quite textbook and the mania I thought I had via bipolar which I didn’t have, was just my very extreme and positive behaviours which was impulsive and let to depressive episodes.

As a result I was then placed on additional medication which added to the ones I was on for BPD and it was actually amphetamines which is technically speed. Which is weird because when people ask how does it works, basically it’s organising my brain as my thought patterns are scattered all over the place.

Instead of getting nothing done and having “brain buffering” it helps me have more constructive thought patterns. My boyfriend often says I must be so tired because my brain just doesn’t stop. I’ll be lying in bed fixating on the littlest of things until 3am.

The more I try not to think about it the more I do. I’ll have conversations in my head but the meds definitely help me manage it.

It goes into my impulses to help me to not drink so much and abuse drugs. I did get drunk the week before my birthday whilst on the meds which didn’t help. I went out with some colleagues and the next day I had panic attacks so severe that my hands seized up. My body wasn’t used to it especially with the meds and I just felt awful.

I’d only been on meds for two weeks and had side effects such as weight loss and panic attacks. It really scared me as the meds made my heart rate go up as well as increased blood pressure. I’ve had alcohol intake since but my body’s more used to it.

That might though I did get shit faced and got in at 3am. My boyfriend had a go at me as we were supposed to go to Tenby to celebrate my 30th birthday.

We got into the car to leave and I was in a state due to the hangover but as we reached the M4 to get to Tenby, my hands actually seized up due to the panic attacks. My boyfriend had to pull over in order to calm me down so it was most definitely a wake up call. We all have them and he said to me that I need to sort things out.

My boyfriend doesn’t drink which helps and I knew in needed to sort my behaviours out, especially with toxic groups. I had to stop bothering with certain people who did a lifestyle of drinking, taking coke and smoking weed. They don’t have addictive personalities and mental health problems. It doesn’t consume them and know when to stop.

It was never just a little bit for me, I’d dive in and take ages to get better by feeling mentally and physically unwell.

The last few months my BPD has been worse and I have had moments where I’ve struggled. I’ve spoken to people like yourself and other friends and family as well as my boyfriend. I’ve lost a lot of weight and I’ve rung my support team for help and don’t feel like I’ve had much help.

They’ve said things like “you’re just having a difficult time” and I know it’s more than that. Like I said BPD is a tough thing to treat and that’s a lot of the feedback you get and I need help. I needed coping mechanisms as I went from bad ones to none at all. I asked to be referred to DBT and they said they wouldn’t because it was “too expensive”.

How can you sit there and say that my life has a price on it. It’s quite upsetting as well as frustrating. The one thing that’s proven to be helpful for BPD. I would feel things like abandonment fears that my boyfriend would leave me. It’s painful and the negativity takes over to manifest themselves in toxic ways. DPT will help you re-evaluate how you view things.

One of my Reddit forums turned out to be helpful as a random person sent me some worksheets which is more than what’s being offered via the support I have from professionals at the moment.

The learning process for both disorders are hard as they are educational. BPD is most definitely the more stigmatised of the two and it’s really difficult to get the help I need. That most definitely needs to change not just for me but for so many others as well.

You’ve been sharing the benefits of your lifestyle changes. What led you to make them and how beneficial have they been?

Like we’ve discussed, the panic attack in the car was a massive wake up call for me. It’s been a year since I’ve last abused drugs and a lot of the changes I can say is down to my boyfriend. Him being in my life is a massive benefit and I owe Ross so much.

We met through friends at a party and the boys kind of warned him about me. Due to the fact he doesn’t drink and he doesn’t share a lot, it was totally different to me as I was an over-sharer. In fact these boys pretty much said not to get involved with me because I’m a lot to deal with.

In the end he thought fuck it and went on a date with me and found I wasn’t like what they said. I wasn’t drunk and abusing myself like in the past, I was being myself and we’ve been together for just over a year now. He got to know me not for what the toxic side I was displaying in the past.

He gets annoyed that people don’t see the real me and still have these conceptions. He tells me I need to realise my own self worth a lot more than I do and to back myself a lot more. He’s right as I don’t have to live like this. Why do I feel like I don’t deserve a better life? I thought this realised I can do better.

That inspired me to apply to university and that’s a lot down to Ross. Like I made the decision and it’s my life but having that form of support is just incredible and having him there is a massive boost and having that genuine connection is amazing.

I went for a good 4 months sober until Christmas with my Mam where we had a little drink. I didn’t feel the need to binge like before and I felt like it was “normal people” did. Like have a sociable drink and then go to bed or whatever. I’d wake up the next day in a good way, not hungover so I felt the benefits for sure. Since then I’ve only had one other instance where I had a drink and that was a few weeks ago.

I wasn’t an alcoholic but didn’t have a healthy relationship with the drink. I could reset myself and know I can enjoy one or two but with the meds I know I need to moderate it. I have been a lot better physically and mentally.

I am struggling a bit more as I’ve mentioned that I don’t have these coping mechanisms any more. There were toxic ones but not having any now is a lot down to the lack of support for BPD but at the same time I’m on good medication as well as having a really supportive boyfriend. Plus there’s a small group of friends I still have who’s helpful too.

There’s most definitely pros and cons but I know to never go back down that road again as it’s more harmful than I imagined before I was diagnosed for sure.

You’re massively influenced by music and fashion. How important are they in helping you through a difficult time?

Fashion is a massive influence and a great help. Another thing with both ADHD and BPD is struggling with self identity as you attach yourself to other people and mimic other people s personalities. When you’re on your own you don’t really know who you are as you’re used to mirroring other people and how they are.

I find with fashion, I’m mimicking trends instead of people. My personality doesn’t change as I do change trends with my clothes quite often. I suppose it feels more of a character change instead of personality and it’s much healthier than what I was doing before.

By attaching myself to a trend it’s so creative. I don’t think I’m articulate and confident in certain things which drives my boyfriend wild. I’m not shy but fashion I know I’m good and confident with it. No matter what happens I know I have that to go back on.

With music it’s everything to me. As you know I love Lana Del Rey. She speaks to my soul and her music means so much to me. She does it every time and her music is depressing as fuck but her songs are so relatable.

I can’t really explain it but I need to listen to happier songs. Me and my friends that I worked with in Topshop used to joke about listening to sad songs whilst working and looking lethargic. I’ve started listening to more cheesy, happier pop punk stuff which helps with that. I love bands like Mayday Parade, Knuckle Puck and mid western Emo bands like Title Fight.

You latch onto the same music for years and that’s a comfort for me. Like I struggle to listen to new bands as I just want to know the words to the songs so I feel like I listen to the older stuff a lot more. Just to know and feel a bit nostalgic but there’s so much out there even with bands I listened to before.

Bands like You Me At Six and Neck Deep have new stuff out but I’m still listening to the old stuff so I need to get back to listening to more newer stuff and broadening my horizons.

I didn’t think I’d miss gigs as much but the pandemic have helped me realise that. My last gig was a band called Thrice and I won the tickets in a competition. I never win anything and loved the gig but I now realise how much I miss going to them.

Music is massive and without it, god knows what we could relate to on such a consistent basis and it’s a go to thing for so many people.

How important is reflection and what can be gained from it?

If you don’t reflect you don’t move forward. I think that if you can sit there be accountable for yourself, it goes a long way.

After a period of reflection I can honestly say that I’m no Angel. My actions have caused consequences and I was horrible to certain people including an ex boyfriend.

He wasn’t a saint but I was very much undiagnosed with BPD and wasn’t a good girlfriend to be around. I was acting up a lot, my behaviour was all over the place and we were together for four years. I never physically hit him or anything but my outbursts caused difficult times.

To get better you need to hold yourself accountable. I know what to do and what not to do in order to move forward whilst noticing certain traits which would cause these destructive behaviours. You’ll just keep getting worse if you keep doing them.

What do you wish was more well known about mental health?

I wish that it was more known that different mental health disorders do different things. You see a lot of these advocates online and they only tend to speak about depression or anxiety. It’s amazing that they do things like that don’t get me wrong but if a person comes along who has schizophrenia, BPD or any other disorder which is outside of the “norm” they don’t tend to help as much or at all.

That is the mental illness. There’s so many types of BPD as I’m quite borderline. I’m not an angry person but there’s a type where more outbursts of anger can occur. Just because I have a mental health illness doesn’t mean it’s the same as someone else.

There’s a lot more to it than that and the more that’s focused on, the better it will be. Support is key and if the right training and information is on offer then that will not only help those who need it but the ones offering the help will know exactly what to do.

You can’t just pick and choose as mental health is such a wide variety. There’s so many illnesses now and people including some professionals don’t understand how deep it goes. We’re not meant to have as much information these days but with social media and the internet, we have more information that’s accessible than we want.

It’s tough for us to take it in and if you have a mental health condition which would be effected as a result, you want to turn to the right avenue for support. Much more can be done to help us with that. Like I said there’s a lot of help out there which is fantastic but not as in depth as it should be.

It has to be moderated too. Don’t ram it down a person’s throat and you will get setbacks. It isn’t a smooth road and once you’re better you can have relapses. I hate being this negative but you have to be prepared to the stark realities of mental health.

You do cope better and expectations do get more realistic. I think people just need to take more time and process things as it doesn’t happen overnight. My boyfriend says the old cliche of “it’s a marathon not a sprint” and that couldn’t be more fitting.

What would you say to someone who is struggling and doesn’t know if talking about it is the right thing to do?

My moods can switch quite quickly and it’s noticeable so if you have someone close to you like a boyfriend, girlfriend etc they will notice it. Ross notices a lot as my thought patterns will cause me to think really stupid things. He will help me find the part to talk about it as he makes me aware that it will manifest it’s way into more unusual ways.

If you don’t feel like talking about it, write it down. A journal, diary or even the notes section on your phone is so helpful. By writing it down you’re challenging that thought because it leads you to reflect on it.

Before you get to the point where you it’s going to spill out, you’ll confront it by speaking to someone or writing it down. You’re not letting the negativity win, you’re backing yourself and goes a long way towards a better mindset for sure.

I expected honesty and an depth conversation with Liz and I also expected to learn more about ADHD and BPD as well. I’d heard of these conditions before but never known anyone with them just read about them or seen examples in films and TV.

Liz’s story is most definitely helpful as she’s offering so much resources via her social media by educating people just what these illnesses are. As she mentions, they’re often mistaken for other things and also the help that’s on offer especially for BPD is quite limited. It’s a shame and hopefully more support can be offered in the near future.

I’m very glad she’s in a much better place than her initial diagnosis nearly 4 years ago. At that point I had just been diagnosed with anxiety and depression and we were supporting each other a lot just by talking.

Unfortunately she moved a few months later and I don’t see or speak as much as before but every now and then we will catch up and especially this chat has shown that just by talking, you learn constantly as well supporting each other.

She’s currently studying in university which shows she is realising her self worth and backing herself. Her love for fashion is still going strong and anyone who follows her Instagram page will see that for themselves.

I’m glad she’s settled into a loving relationship with her boyfriend Ross. She looks incredibly happy and she totally deserves it. Her lifestyle changes are beneficial too as it all aids towards a more positive and healthier mindset.

Like many others, she’s not where she wants to be but she’s a far way from where she was and that’s amazing to see.

As always thanks very much for the support. If you’ve taken the time to read this or any other post it means the world that you have. One day at a time we’re eliminating the stigmas around mental health and making it a better place to talk about our problems.

Below the post I’ve added some links for more information on ADHD and BPD. Thank you again to Liz for speaking to me and wish her nothing but the very best and hopefully I’ll see her soon for a catch up.

Take care, stay safe and until next time don’t think of this as a goodbye but more of a see you later!

www.nhs.uk/conditions/attention-deficit-hyperactivity-disorder-adhd/

www.healthline.com/health/adhd

www.yourhealthinmind.org/mental-illnesses-disorders/bpd